Philemon Chambers

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In Conversation with Philemon Chambers & Nate Gualtieri

Photography by Yuri Hasegawa

Styling by Brooke Shepherd

Grooming by Emily Zempel

Photo Assisting by Elliot Smith-Hastie

Philemon: I got into acting at 13 after my parents took me to see The Lion King at the Pantages. I fell in love with the theatrics of it. As time went on, my “why” for acting changed. Initially, I just wanted to be heard and seen, being the bullied kid. Then, I shifted to wanting to learn and grow. I took a five-year acting break due to an abusive relationship. In 2019, I came back, and I did a short film that is near and dear to my heart because it was the first time that I had lived my truth out in front of a camera. From there, I guest starred on a TV show, and then Single All the Way, my feature film debut. At this moment in time, I am interested in telling stories where you actually get the essence of who a person is, and their complexities.

Nate: Yeah, I know exactly what you mean. There's a lack of dimensionality of characters. Sometimes, we're afraid to go there. I think that's as frustrating for writers as it is for actors. You started professionally at 13, right? I was looking at the SAG-AFTRA proposals, and they're talking about protections for child actors above 14. Looking at the strike that's happening now, do you look back and think, “Oh, I wish I had these protections then?” What is that like for you?

Philemon: Definitely. I consider myself lucky compared to some child actors who went through a lot. I think it's great that we're working on protecting young actors now. When people ask about putting their kids into acting, I tell them to wait until they're older. I started at 13, and I remember a casting experience where I was body-shamed. I was placed in a room and had a casting person walk around me and call me fat. It led to issues like anorexia, bulimia, and body dysmorphia. Kids are often pushed into acting by adults for fame or money. And the kids really don't want to be there. I took my job very seriously, but I’d be around younger kids who just did not care. They would throw the biggest temper tantrums. I wish there were a way to shuffle the people that want to do it by the people that should be in it, and the people that don't want to do it.

Nate: When you're a child, you don't know how to really advocate for yourself in that environment. How can the industry put protections in place? And how can we educate casting directors to treat child actors with sensitivity? I mean, I struggled with body image, too as a kid. started Weight Watchers when I was eight years old.

Philemon: It's a great question. It's important to bring these issues to light. Did you see Elle Fanning’s Round Table interview? She was saying that she had auditioned for this father-daughter road trip comedy situation, and she had heard through the grapevine that the reason that she didn't get it was because she wasn't fuckable. And mind you, she's a little kid.

Nate: Yeah.

Philemon: If we could have something in place to train young actors entering the industry, teaching them what's right and wrong. They need to know they can stand up for themselves and say no. I didn't say things in the past because I was afraid of getting blackballed. You always heard that if you spoke up, you would get blackballed. That was normal. Unfortunately, even today, big corporations will try to monopolize you. They have more resources and outreach, and it's hard to fight against. But what's changing now is that the public is supporting artists and challenging these industries.

Nate: What feels most important to you from your perspective in this negotiation? What are you hoping for?

Philemon: Just a fair deal. I think that it is ridiculous that, I forget the percentage, but that the majority of actors do not make $26,000 in order to qualify for healthcare. That is absolutely ridiculous. You live below the poverty line, and you still want to do this. It just goes to show that the old system that we had in place is not working. The cost of living has gone up, and we should follow suit. 

I also know with African-American actors, that they are fighting to get hairstylists and makeup artists in the room of the same background. Sets should be diverse in general. If you don't have a diverse set, you're doing an injustice to what we as artists thrive on. When I worked on my streaming feature, I had to fight for a black hairstylist. I can't come 2000 miles and not have anybody who knows how to work with black hair because it's a different thing.

Nate: It's frustrating that you had to fight for it in the first place. And it always puts you at a disadvantage as an actor. I think it's one of those things where it’s an issue that probably goes so far above the heads of the people who are in the negotiation room. It’s up to the union to really make sure they’re getting behind it.

Nate: This strike has really allowed us to see those differences in pay and the reality of what it is to be a famous actor versus an actor who is financially making a career out of this. There was a TikTok from Kimiko Glenn, she had a residual check for 3 cents. And you think, oh, they were on a hit Netflix series from the very start of the platform. 

I do want to talk about our CW experience and working in a network show because I actually got my first residual check recently.  If this had been on streaming, I wouldn’t have residuals based on performance because we are not allowed to see performance data for the shows. That residual check allows me to exist for another two months. I was curious — what has it been like for you working on something that's streaming vs network, or a feature vs a network? What are the financial implications for you?

Philemon: Working with Netflix was good pay-wise, but people often misunderstand the money aspect. Yes, you can make a lot, but you also dish out basically 60% of it.

Nate: Totally.

Philemon: For Single All The Way, we filmed in Canada, and they took around $40,000 right off my check before I even saw it. That’s before my agent and manager fees. There's also PR representation cost. 

Nate: There are so many costs. The 40% is that tax because it was a Canadian production?

Philemon: You get taxed by Canada and the providence, which left me with almost nothing. I was going broke when my movie came out. I was on this extreme high while on this extreme low of — what in the fuck do I do? I can't go back to a regular job. When I say regular job, I don't mean it in the disrespectful way of like, “Oh, I'm just too big for that.” I’m throwing myself into what I want to do and what I want to be, and I have to take that risk on myself. 

Nate: We haven't really touched on AI too much in our conversation.

Philemon: I read something recently about innovation in the industry. There was this Disney project where AI was used to assist in creating the opening credits of a Samuel L. Jackson show. They said that it didn't replace anyone's job; just aided the editors. But the show got a lot of backlash from it.

Nate: How do you feel about that situation? Are you unsure about your stance?

Philemon: Well, I love Samuel L. Jackson, but I haven’t actually watched the show. As for my thoughts on AI, I'm indifferent about it. If AI is genuinely a tool to assist — and we have to break down what we mean by “assist” — if the writers, or actors, or creative team are involved and want to use the tool, I would be more open.

Nate: That makes sense. It's definitely a topic that warrants discussion.

Philemon: My biggest fear is sustainability. If writers are being threatened by AI, you’re threatening the actors too. There’s no interpretation that I can give from something that was written by a computer that has no emotional tie to it. For me, the idea that my industry could become obsolete — or that you can replace me with AI, is horrifying.

Nate: It’s been around for a while, but I don't know why it's kind of become such a central issue all of a sudden. I wonder if it would've had the same treatment three years ago, but we didn't go on strike, and I think a lot of that had to do with the pandemic. It certainly has advanced so much in the past three years. I thought this was supposed to make our lives easier. Not cost people their jobs.

At the end of the day, what is it for? It’s not to make people’s jobs easier, it’s to make the executives more money to make their profit margins larger.

Nate: There were a couple of articles that came out from a book called Burn It Down by Maureen Ryan. Highly recommend. The book is about the ways that toxic culture in Hollywood at the higher echelons affects all of the creatives on every level downward. We are finally saying out loud that you should watch out for this. It goes hand in hand with eliminating that culture because it comes with eliminating the financial instability in this industry. You're afraid of losing your job. Because everything is so financially unstable, it's such a high-stakes thing to even speak out on those issues.

Philemon: The funny thing, even though this year has been hard, I've had to discover new ways of feeding that artist. I coach actors now, which is so weird for me to say because I never considered myself a teacher of any sort, but I just realized sharing information can make you a teacher. Honestly, I'm looking forward to the resurgence of what feels like will be our renaissance. When we come out of this, people are going to be ready to tell stories. Writers are going to have new perspectives on things, or they've had an idea that they've been working on, and now they've gotten the chance to actually work on it and actually sift out some good shit. I'm interested in seeing the resurgence of actors’ hunger and directors taking a little bit more charge of things. I'm excited for all of our industry in general, because, again, we may be going through a rough patch right now, but just over that hill is a patch of green grass, and eventually, there'll be another patch and another patch, and then we'll have green valleys.

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